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  1. #301
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    By the way. I have a dropbox set up full of coaching stuff. If anybody wants to join pm me your email address. You can easily share anything you may have with the rest of us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    I don't think that kid commuted from Cairo paul.............


    Your compairing professional football clubs with grassroots football. We don't have professional academies.

    Completely different set of rules. The pros cater for education etc.
    No he wouldn't be commuting, his family would have upped sticks and moved. So basically from what I can see the German system bans somebody travelling over 8km to train but has issue with a family moving from a different country to live near the club. I honestly think you have it wrong.

    In any successful football nation, the best kids go to the best clubs as soon as they are identified. Germany is no different.

    We both agree there are huge problems in our grassroots. Making a kid play within 3km of his house won't solve anything.
    I know you are a supporter of leagues for kids, that's where I think the problem lies and I'd the first thing that needs to be addressed.

    Btw Genesis are drawing up a report on the set up of the ddsl. Looking like a non competitive situation up to under 12.

  3. #303
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    Btw Genesis are drawing up a report on the set up of the ddsl. Looking like a non competitive situation up to under 12.
    based on my post yesterday? jaysus they're quick
    "We've seen you come, we'll see you go"

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  5. #304
    John McDonnell
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    By the way. I have a dropbox set up full of coaching stuff. If anybody wants to join pm me your email address. You can easily share anything you may have with the rest of us.

    If you do join DONT remove any items as then we all lose them.
    pm sent thanks

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  7. #305
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post

    We both agree there are huge problems in our grassroots. Making a kid play within 3km of his house won't solve anything.
    I know you are a supporter of leagues for kids, that's where I think the problem lies and I'd the first thing that needs to be addressed.
    .

    Kid will learn more from playing at their level than winning 9-0 or losing 9-0. The only way kids will find their level is a league structure with promotion/relegation. I'm not for one minute saying leagues should be published and trophies doled out but we need that structure. Call the leagues by different colours even instead of A,B,C etc.

    I have every recognised badge available in this country to coach players up to elite U18 plus plenty more. Hoppo the same. Throw in hoppos degree and we have every base covered. We are among the most highly qualified coaches in the area. That said
    I can say for certain our lads learned more last season playing at their level that we could have taught them in 3 years. Hano and Dunny are going through the same process this year.

    Our lads got battered from aug till xmas 2011. In calender year 2012 they lost one league match. 90% of that Improvement is due to the fact they get questions asked of their ability every saturday. I have no doubt in my mind on this what so ever. All me a hoppo do is keep it ticking over and keep an eye on technique. Very little really.
    I used to know it all, Now I'm going to school.

  8. #306
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    have no problem whatsoever with 12/13/14 year olds playing league football. I do have a problem with 7/8/9/10year olds playing league football. Its counter productive and flies in the face of everything we should be teaching kids at that age.

    FWIW here's the scenario i would favour.

    kids up to 11 play in acadamies for whatever club they want. They train within their agegroups and play games no bigger than 3v3 among themselves.
    Once a month there are blitzes. Lets say lourdes ring st francis and they bring their under 8,9, and 10's. Tea coffee etc is provided for the parents and they are told to stand well back fron the pitches. Kids play games against each other, where no scores are kept or mentioned.
    Small prizes are given out for "Skill of the game" for the kids who performs a nice trick or the team who strings the most passes together. After these games ALL the kids head indoors for a film/clown/magician/bouncy castle and mingle TOGETHER. Totally taking away the competitive side of things.

    Every kid gets a cert and they head home happy with absolutely no care whatsoever if they win lose or draw and most wouldnt even no anyway.

    Leagues are killing our game Alan. They need to be scrapped not restructured.

  9. #307
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Kids playing matches once a month wont help them develop. Maybe once every two months in winter due to weather. There's stuff they learn on a pitch a coach can never teach.

    My daughter was in the blitz culture in camogie. Disaster from start to finish. There's nothing wrong with a 3:1 training match ratio imo.
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  10. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    Kids playing matches once a month wont help them develop. Maybe once every two months in winter due to weather. There's stuff they learn on a pitch a coach can never teach. .
    lol they'll be playing matches in every session they do. No bigger the 3v3 though. We need to move away from the idea that 7v7 matches with refs, jersies, goals and parents are benifitting kids. They're not. A kid will learn way more in a 3v3 training game then in a 7v7 match. Thats pretty much established all over the world.....even Germany

  11. #309
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    lol they'll be playing matches in every session they do. No bigger the 3v3 though. We need to move away from the idea that 7v7 matches with refs, jersies, goals and parents are benifitting kids. They're not. A kid will learn way more in a 3v3 training game then in a 7v7 match. Thats pretty much established all over the world.....even Germany
    English fa has spent millions on their future vision. Still involves kids playing every week its actually not a million miles from what we do here.

    http://www.thecoachdiary.com/grassro...ireland-fai-0/

    As i said keep the structures but take away the competitive edge by not publishing tables or giving out cups and medals.

    By far the biggest problem we have is the coach education not the size of pitches. No point in having what they do in Spain or anywhere else if the coach doesn't understand the game and is not qualified to teach it. Id say about 40% are qualified to coach. That number is about 15% at 11aside.


    You can have a fantastic school but if you have and idiot teaching the kids will learn fuck all.
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  12. #310
    Pat Kelch
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    Have you two been having this discussion all night?!!! I must say I do prefer the idea of kids playing locally. In my time the majority of kids who have moved from my teams have moved to another Lucan club to be with their mates, not outside the 'parish'. Where a kid has moved to one of the 'bigger' clubs it has almost always been at the whim of a parent. I think we should scrap all the Dublin leagues and replace them with just one. I wouldn't have any competitive football until 15 - this would remove the ambitious parent overnight. Clubs could be feeder clubs for LOI centres of 'excellence' depending on location. Any player leaving for a price would have his transfer fee shared by all that teams affiliates. The rest not playing u15 LOI would become competitive where I imagine there would not be a load of movement, but could, at that stage, be allowed anywhere.At that age the parents don't even show up at matches anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    English fa has spent millions on their future vision. Still involves kids playing every week its actually not a million miles from what we do here.
    the english way was wrong 2 pages ago and its right now???

    As i said they will be playing every week, in fact every session.

    we need to ignore the english way. As i said 3v3 all day long. Develops game intelligence and makes forces the kids to make decisions. Its the Horst Wein way. Have studied it to death and its the best way forward. Have no interest in the fai badges now but of course i'll have to do them $$$$$$$.

  14. #312
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    the english way was wrong 2 pages ago and its right now???

    As i said they will be playing every week, in fact every session.

    we need to ignore the english way. As i said 3v3 all day long. Develops game intelligence and makes forces the kids to make decisions. Its the Horst Wein way. Have studied it to death and its the best way forward. Have no interest in the fai badges now but of course i'll have to do them $$$$$$$.

    That's the new English system. Not even implemented yet.

    Jaysus thats the Germans and Brits 5 million quid plan dismissed. Fair play to ya.
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    the english way was wrong 2 pages ago and its right now???

    As i said they will be playing every week, in fact every session.

    we need to ignore the english way. As i said 3v3 all day long. Develops game intelligence and makes forces the kids to make decisions. Its the Horst Wein way. Have studied it to death and its the best way forward. Have no interest in the fai badges now but of course i'll have to do them $$$$$$$.
    Feel like ive arrived late at the party here ! Just a word on horst wein , he is often debunked as being slightly out of date when compared to modern thinking.

    Aside from that point id be wary of basing my coaching philosophy on one persons theory. Now the spanish model is the hot topic , the dutch after the 70', italian , german,french and english theorys have all been envogue.

    The problem in ireland is we are keen to copy what seems to be the answer instead of having the forward thinking approach of developing our own based on the combination of what works abroad.
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  17. #314
    John McDonnell
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    What's the Spanish method like, lads? Yiz are all talking about England and Germany here. But, nowt about Spain.

    Interesting read this, all the same!

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    Super Moderator Jimdagym's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antomorro View Post
    What's the Spanish method like, lads? Yiz are all talking about England and Germany here. But, nowt about Spain.

    Interesting read this, all the same!
    I don't know who's side I am on!!!
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  20. #316
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoppo254 View Post
    Feel like ive arrived late at the party here ! Just a word on horst wein , he is often debunked as being slightly out of date when compared to modern thinking.

    Aside from that point id be wary of basing my coaching philosophy on one persons theory. Now the spanish model is the hot topic , the dutch after the 70', italian , german,french and english theorys have all been envogue.

    The problem in ireland is we are keen to copy what seems to be the answer instead of having the forward thinking approach of developing our own based on the combination of what works abroad.
    Agreed we need to learn from others but have our own style.

    Id never dismiss any coaching methods or badges etc. Everything has merits and weaknesses in relation to each individual kid never mind each club or league. The more we learn the better we become.

    We haven't even touched player psychology yet......

    I'm from the Abrahams school!!!! Lol.
    I used to know it all, Now I'm going to school.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    That's the new English system. Not even implemented yet.

    Jaysus thats the Germans and Brits 5 million quid plan dismissed. Fair play to ya.
    Haven't dismissed anything. I just have an opinion.
    From what I remember you were very critical of the English system when it was published

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    Quote Originally Posted by antomorro View Post
    What's the Spanish method like, lads? Yiz are all talking about England and Germany here. But, nowt about Spain.

    Interesting read this, all the same!
    Spanish version is even more stripped back. 3v3's everywhere. Horst Wein wrote the development handbook for the Spanish fa in 1992. It doesn't take a genius to work out how successful it is. They have won 60% of world and euro championships (including youth) since its implementation. Basically the mans a genius. If you have any interest in coaching, buy his books and DVD's. He believes in challenging the kids to come up with the answers themselves as opposed to telling them what to do. He believes in challenging a kid in a 3v3 by putting in various challenges in the game. On my phone so can't go deep into it but its very interesting

  23. #319
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    Spanish version is even more stripped back. 3v3's everywhere. Horst Wein wrote the development handbook for the Spanish fa in 1992. It doesn't take a genius to work out how successful it is. They have won 60% of world and euro championships (including youth) since its implementation. Basically the mans a genius. If you have any interest in coaching, buy his books and DVD's. He believes in challenging the kids to come up with the answers themselves as opposed to telling them what to do. He believes in challenging a kid in a 3v3 by putting in various challenges in the game. On my phone so can't go deep into it but its very interesting
    The dutch have been preaching the triangle (3v3) since the the 60s paul not 1992. The whole reason Ajax played 4-3-3 was because of the amount of passing triangles created on the pitch. When you think of the Dutch coaches at Barca in the 90s its as big a factor as anything.

    The Dutch handprint is all over barca. Cryuff etc.
    I used to know it all, Now I'm going to school.

  24. #320
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    oh btw the sdfl are doing brilliant work on 3v3 workshops if anyone wants to get me an invite...

    Hint hint bren.......
    I used to know it all, Now I'm going to school.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    The dutch have been preaching the triangle (3v3) since the the 60s paul not 1992. The whole reason Ajax played 4-3-3 was because of the amount of passing triangles created on the pitch. When you think of the Dutch coaches at Barca in the 90s its as big a factor as anything.

    The Dutch handprint is all over barca. Cryuff etc.
    You really have to start reading my posts properly. I said he wrote the development handbook for the Spanish fa in 1992

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    Packie Lynch
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    You really have to start reading my posts properly. I said he wrote the development handbook for the Spanish fa in 1992
    He did indeed and as part of the human kinetics research his game intelligence concept was was considered an excellent step on research previously conducted by the american athletics association when it came to overall coaching and ability to empower the athlete to think about their sport.

    In fact a lot of his earlier papers involve very little "drills" or games and focus on immersion within the sport. Its clear to see the melding of his earlier works with something quite similar to the "freedom" and coaching methods used by the dutch in the 60's and 70's.

    Great philosphy and packaged very well but based on old idea's.

    As i said , pick and choose coaches or programs that match how you feel the game should be played.

    You only have to loom at these Barca training camps now to see hundreds of schoolboy coaches trying to find the holy grail

    *The american athletics association under the NACACAA umbrella btw
    Last edited by hoppo254; 28th November 2012 at 07:51 PM.
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  27. #323
    Packie Lynch
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    The irony of ironies , it took a german who had dutch ancestory with research based on american and dutch ideas to teach the spanish how to play football.

    I actually think wein's family where of jewish heritage..... so lets all fuck off to israel !
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  28. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoppo254 View Post

    As I said , pick and choose coaches or programs that match how you feel the game should be played
    This is exactly how I feel too. Have studied a lot of methods and at the moment i'm mixing Horst wein witha bit of coerver. Send a few lads to a Brazilian footy gig on Friday. No one way is right, so its best to immerse yourself in everything and pick the best bits.

    Brought the kids to blanch IT for a strength and conditioning class and nutrition chat last week. Would have laughed at the idea two years ago but it was excellent

  29. #325
    John McDonnell
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post
    This is exactly how I feel too. Have studied a lot of methods and at the moment i'm mixing Horst wein witha bit of coerver. Send a few lads to a Brazilian footy gig on Friday. No one way is right, so its best to immerse yourself in everything and pick the best bits.

    Brought the kids to blanch IT for a strength and conditioning class and nutrition chat last week. Would have laughed at the idea two years ago but it was excellent

    What age team d'ya coach Saintly?

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    Under 10 and 11's haha I know i'm mad

  31. #327
    Packie Lynch
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    Fuck you saintly seeing another strength and conditioning coach behind my back lol

    Keep it local !

    This is how football works: God created the jews, the jews have all the money. The largest decimation of jewish populous by the germans was in holland. Ajax are a heavily jewish based club when it comes to support base. Ajax and further more barcelona are based on cryuff and michels idea's.

    Trace it all back....you should be reading the bible for coaching tips ! . 3-0 (Father 12,Son 27,Holy Ghost 68)
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  33. #328
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    Haha classic

    Btw I thought of you when we were looking at the s&c but I think I would have had a visit from alammc in the middle of the night if I asked you to come up

  34. #329
    Mbabazi AlanMc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintly View Post

    Brought the kids to blanch IT for a strength and conditioning
    Its locking up ya need!!!!

    Sure it wasn't an ABC he done with them?
    I used to know it all, Now I'm going to school.

  35. #330
    Packie Lynch
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    Saintly be careful on strength and con at their age. Might be better focusing on agility balance and co-ordination.

    Dunno how your lads would take it but try convince them to do a samba class. Co-ordination and balance will improve greatly...but their attraction to men might also !
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